Should the US get involved in Ukraine?

[VADM A Reaves]

What are the general thoughts on this topic. It seems to divide into so many different arguments I thought this is a great place for that.

[ADM S Osman]

U.S. intelligence officials have moved to declassify what they have said is a Russian plan to spread disinformation about Ukraine. 

Some few days ago I read this article from Times that more or less describes the issues Russia and Ukraine have. Its a short read, I recommend it if its available. [ https://time.com/6148791/william-burns-cia-russia-declassify/ ] 

I personally don't think the US should get involved but because of NATO it may be asked to provide resources in many different ways. There are already special forces elements gathered behind the local militia in Ukraine from various countries. The guerrilla warfare strategists will probably play out a longer invasion than necessary as sanctions are imposed on Russia by all sorts of countries. I am more interested in the reaction of the UK and other European military powers. The UN is a shell of any governing body but NATO have more ulterior motives. Other business parties might be involved as I understand Ukraine is one of the largest European countries and there is probably money somewhere to be pillaged. 

[Accessing]

No, not really any benefit. It seems like Russia was calculated in this approach and any good deals would likely fall through for the US to benefit. Even if, if not already actually the CIA was backfunneling weapons and training from special forces officers. The kind of defeat/victory that people are idealizing isn't going to be the one realized; If anything the sanctions were prepared for and the money thats there in Ukraine is the number one hot topic to contest.

I don't think the US should be involved because NATO has other foreign powers capable and more actionable but I know we're going to help. Having bases in Germany and other black sites around Europe in Romania and Ukraine both fully US and shared where NATO allies do not want to expend resources or look to overestimate in use of force they will rely on the US.

The money is kind of a hot topic that I'm not seeing too much about. Before the invasion, Ukraine's government had spent $63m USD on Bitcoin though this is the active moving of assets to secure its financial institutions its not really given as to why or even who it could have been held by probably for obvious reason. This is one of the smartest things anyone could possibly do in the guise of a coming attack. Now whats completely unfounded is if this moving money into digital money will save Ukraine from complete financial turmoil because if I am not mistaken Russia could storm the banks, lowering all of the currencies in Europe for a more vicious attack on actual currency. Attacking money by lowering its value, can give Russian billionaiires and elites opportunity to grow exponentially and fund a greater more elaborate war. This might be just my explosive imagination though. 

As we've seen already this is the 3rd Invasion by Russia in the past and Russia would only do what they can get away with. 

I want to include too, the false media and narratives created around this between Washington DC and Moscow. There is like a weird panic all over the internet and false information everywhere again, when all of the attacks filmed and videos so far (now 12 hours into the invasion) has been secluded to key points Russia identified would be important for control of the nation. This includes anti-air missile systems across the country and other military sites. There seems to be no accurate information on any civilian casualties so far, if there are it might be in the form of government contracting. 

I say weird panic because most headlines are reading to incite people to act or push anxiety onto the public. Its a little bit of a shame to see that same article you shared even written in a tone to convey that. Theres another article blantantly saying the US is deploying troops to Ukraine when the Biden administration officially said they wouldn't so the kind of fact checking is low around Times and many more outlets it looks like and as always the emotional intelligence to gauge the populice and write into peoples feelings is at an all time high again. 

I'm worried about their livelihood, as the upper class of Ukraine fly out very earlier on the engagement (there has been activity now for +9 months there) the savings held by Ukraine banks are at risk of getting plundered and the people with cash might soon find it valueless.

 

[VADM A Reaves]

Well its escalated from my first post. Looks like the US is not looking to get involved further than you mentioned. Its probably for the best and I really don't know too much about world financial economy to comment on attacking currency but do see a very real implication of opportunity there. I just saw the Russian index fund is down by 50% and all gains from 2021 were basically wiped out. Something tells me they don't care about that though.

15 hours ago, Accessing said:

As we've seen already this is the 3rd Invasion by Russia in the past and Russia would only do what they can get away with. 

3rd Invasion?

Crimeria I know of, is there another one?

 

[CAPT N Reibach]

What happens to money in the bank during a war and can the government seize it?
During a war, the main economic concern is avoiding inflation and keeping banks stable. However, the more aggressive a war becomes, the more inflation becomes highly likely. Throughout history, it wasn't uncommon for people to trade their cash for things like gold and other precious metals. A government can seize money from people in certain situations.

For example, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau recently froze the accounts of people who received crowdfunding deposits for protesting against vaccine mandates. In history, wars that reach extreme points see the infiltrating country impose their own currency over the country they are invading, while in other cases the stock market suffers. Currently, banks are hit in a more technological way during periods of war and conflict.

https://twitter.com/business/status/1496749746790465543?s=20&t=3bzJxcIGGHZVyaUR1kjpbw

According to recent reports, Ukrainian banks and government websites were hit by a cyberattack. The attack flooded the network and prevented other people from accessing it. Although there are speculations that Russia is responsible for the attack, the speculations haven't been confirmed. White House officials said, “We consider these further incidents to be consistent with the type of activity Russia would carry out in a bid to destabilize Ukraine.”

Currently, in Ukraine, people are lining up to withdraw money for themselves and their families. The Donetsk central bank placed a withdrawal limit max of 10,000 roubles or $129 a day, although credit card purchases are currently stable.

[CAPT N Reibach]

During wars, such as World War II, banking goes on as usual with a few differences:

• Enemy assets and bank accounts are seized; meaning if the address on the account is located in an enemy country, then the government takes the money in the account
• Non-sovereign accounts are frozen; what this means is that if a foreign country has a sovereignty problem, then any accounts originating in that country are usually frozen until the sovereignty problem is solved; this happens whenever a country is conquered by another, for example.
• Foreign exchange with the enemy is ended. That means you can't send money or receive money from an enemy country.
• When a foreign country is occupied normally the local banks are shut down and the money is replaced either with that of the conquering nation or with a military scrip which is issued by the occupying army.

If you have a bank account in a conquered country, usually any money in that account becomes worthless, because the whole banking system of the country no longer functions. If you have gold deposits or safety boxes in a bank, however, those may be honored, at least temporarily.

[Accessing]

So much to understand and learn about. Can't even begin with the amount of information available around this, even the countless studies up to it. 

 I don't doubt the University of Chicago and this professors review. I recommend giving a listen if you have the time. 

[Dunbar]

We've been blue balled from an enemy stupid enough to wear a uniform for twenty years. Id give my left nut to kill a Russian.

I was stupid and got rid of all my excess gear when i got out. Save up for some plates and hope theres still some Ivan left. 

I think, despite all that, that leaving it to mercenaries while providing military aid was smart. CIA did the same for the Mujahideen in Afghanistan. Thats not a war the american people want to see their fellows die in but it IS a war most want to see Ukraine win. Seeing US Marines and Army vets with multiple deployments heading over to shit on assholes who haven't been fighting a two decade long war is amazing and every news broadcast with dead Russian generals and an alive Zekensky is a good broadcast to start a positive day to. 

 

Edit: Watching ukrainian farmers meme on dead Russian tankies is comedy gold.